From Addiction to Real Freedom with Eric Frederickson Episode

SPEAKER_00 0:34

Hello everyone, thank you again for joining us on another episode of the Dorsey show. In today's episode of Eric Ferguson is a biblical life coach selling author of Recovering Reality, Freedom from Torment of Addiction, and Speaker with 17 years of personal freedom from addiction and twelve years coaching hundreds of people for the weight lagging over seven thousand hours of one-on-one coaching is the founder of recovery reality and has reached over one hundred thousand people through his users and devotionals across a hundred and fi and ninety countries. Eric, thank you so much for coming on the show today.

SPEAKER_01 1:46

Oh, you're very welcome, man. It's a privilege to be here. I'm excited to have a conversation with you.

SPEAKER_00 1:51

Absolutely. Tell us a little bit more about yourself and about your background and about you know your story.

SPEAKER_01 1:59

Yeah. Stories are an important part of recovery, I believe, because uh addiction, everybody everyone's story is a little different, but uh when it comes to addiction, you can find similarities in all of them. I was raised in a good home. My family's all Mormon. Uh wasn't for me, but there was no drugs or alcohol in my house, and moved to and I was born in the Bay Area, moved to the the state of Utah with my family when I was 10 years old, and just a few years after being there, started getting into drugs, alcohol, and it just immediately became a problem. Just immediately in my life. And and maybe you've heard, you know, addiction is a progressive disease, and it truly does. If someone really has issues with addiction, it always gets worse. I've never seen anyone really, really have an issue and then maintain their substance use and it not be a problem in their life anymore. And it just uh it just picked up speed. Played sports, uh, was was a good athlete, but couldn't stay away from the drugs and alcohol. Watched over 30 of my it that lasted from the the age of 13 to 26, and uh watched over 30 of my friends die uh from addiction. I didn't like witness it right before my eyes, but all around me, you know, suicide, drug overdose, freak accident, all involving drugs and alcohol, two rehabs, hospitals, jails, institutions, suicide attempt. It just It wasn't good. Addiction's not conducive with living real life. The age of 26, man, it uh it got bad enough where I I finally faced things and started to go on the journey to see what real freedom looks like uh in my life.

SPEAKER_00 3:41

And what did that look like for you?

SPEAKER_01 3:45

Yeah, well, initially it looked like a lot of problems. Uh you know, my external circumstances had been worse in my life many times. Uh, you know, getting arrested or waking up in jail, and I don't know how I got there because I was blackout drunk or a long list of other things. But at the age of 26, I just I had it had never been worse internally. It's my inner world, depression. I was just hollow, just no hope, just nothing. The journey looked like, well, initially I got arrested and went to my last rehab. And then after that, I packed up everything I had and I moved out to uh San Diego and started a process because it's really what it is. It's you know, 13 years of 13 years of drug and alcohol addiction, you just take that away. Well, it doesn't just get rid of all of the mindsets and habits and thinking patterns and residue, so to speak, that we pick up in 13 years. I had that illusion in my mind, just get rid of the drugs and alcohol, everything would be perfect. And that's it's just not true. The drugs and alcohol weren't my problem, they were my solution. The problem was what was going on inside of me. And I had to I had to start a journey of real freedom. I had to start taking accountability for my actions, talking to people. I went to AA for about the first year and a half uh of my journey. It was very helpful. And really just learning how to live all over again. God, you know, there's no way I've been able to do it without a relationship with God. It just wouldn't have been possible. Still not to this day. I'll say finish answering your question too. You know, I never heard in my entire life that it's uh it's about relationship, not religion. Never heard that once in my whole life till I got to AA. It's the first place I ever heard that. Growing up in uh in a religious household, it was obey the rules and this is this is what we believe, and you have to do this and you have to do that. I just didn't like it. And when I when I first heard the idea, reality that it's about relationship, not religion, it it sparked something in me.

SPEAKER_00 5:51

What do you think started you, you know, the you know, the track of alcohol and and drugs? Was it something growing up? Was it something, you know, you you dealt with in in the household, or what was it?

SPEAKER_01 6:06

Yeah, it's a good question. No, there was no drugs or alcohol in in my house ever uh growing up, no aunts, uncles. I just wasn't around it at all. But at the age of 13, I was just uh was still somewhat new to living in, you know, Utah, getting into middle school, and just uh still was was a good athlete and was playing sports and just hanging out with uh what I thought was the cool kids. And it was rather harmless, to be honest, in the sense that I wasn't like seeking it out. I didn't really even know what it was or what it would do or anything. I'd heard about it, obviously. It just kind of like, you know, drugs are bad, don't do it. You know, drinking's bad, don't do it. But I didn't really know much about any of it. Just started doing what my friends were doing, you know, when I was around them. But immediately what it started to do is quiet the storm inside of me. Immediately it started to it's it's a counterfeit piece, it's a counterfeit solution. And immediately the problems just began in my life. But there was no huge issue at home or not uh that there was really nothing like that that sent me down that path. But now there's a lot more understanding, a lot more education about what addiction is, what it does, what the drugs and alcohol do to the mind, body, how they destroy lives. And which would have been kind of mid-late 90s, there was some, but not really. Nothing in comparison to what there is today. There was not really. And before I knew it, and that's how most people get sucked into addiction. Not everyone, but most people. They just kind of start venturing down that path to dabble in it. Maybe it's an injury and they get prescribed something. Maybe there's just a way they escape or release, you know, relax, whatever it is. But it got its hooks in me really, really quick, and uh problems started right from the beginning.

SPEAKER_00 8:03

You've been freeing from addiction for 17 years, one that we came for you when nothing else had worked.

SPEAKER_01 8:12

Jesus. Now I'll elaborate on that because that answer is true, but but here's the thing. There's work to be done. You can't just live like that for 13 years and like, oh, let's just take the drugs and alcohol away, you know, everything's perfect. Like I was saying earlier. There's my there's there's mindsets ingrained in there. There's habits and ways of thinking, acting, people were around, all these things. And so one thing that was very beneficial for me is I moved states. So I was just, I was really serious, I was done. I just I didn't I didn't know what a new life looked like. I really I had seen it in some of my friends' lives, they had they had stepped into recovery, but and I had experienced like some months here and there, but I was just white knuckling and not doing anything really. But what really changed is when I got serious about taking accountability, responsibility for my life and becoming very, very intentional about renewing my mind and spending time with God. And it was emphasized to me early on the importance of some things like community, morning routine, connecting with God, you know, accountability, these different things. And these were all new to me. We use the term rehabilitation often. Everyone's probably heard it. And I always respond to that. I'm like, well, most people were never habilitated in the first place. So what are you rehabilitating them to? What it was like back over there, because back over there, those mindsets, habits, and that life led them into addiction. And so, really, what recovery is about is becoming brand new, like stepping into the real you, your potential, your identity in God in a way I had never experienced it in my whole entire life. I didn't know what it was going to look like. I trusted God and the people that were around me, but I began to be very intentional about talking about what was going on, reading, journaling, prayer, and immersing myself in just an entirely new world. And it is a journey. It's not the easiest thing early on. It's certainly not, depending on what people are coming out of. But the biggest thing for me was just really learning how to live life almost for the first time, to be honest. At the age of 26.

SPEAKER_00 10:21

Well, like you, how did you, you know, come to a knowledge of of Christ and accept him as your Lord and Savior?

SPEAKER_01 10:31

Well, I don't think I can give you a short answer on this. So I'll just say this. When I was young, I had some very powerful encounters with God. They were completely it was impossible to deny it, happened a series of times, and I didn't have any theological explanation. I didn't really understand what happened. I didn't really talk to anybody about it either, but I didn't really understand what took place. I just knew that was that was God. That was basically I I just knew it was God, but I didn't I didn't really know who God was or what relationship looked like again or any of that. I I didn't really have an idea. Coming to know Jesus, it truly is about a relationship. The recovery process, when it really takes root, happens from the inside out. Many people try and do it from this is applicable to people who, you know, I so like Dorsey was saying early on, I do coaching, been doing it for over 12 years now, worked with a lot of people. And what I see a lot of the time is people try and bring about a transformation in their life from the outside in. I just need this checklist of things, and if I'll do them, then things will fall in order. The behaviors could even be good activities and behaviors and new disciplines they're applying. But if it doesn't take place from the inside out, it's really it's it's gonna be real tough for it to grow roots and really bring about a transformation. And I just became very intentional about spending time with God, getting to know who God really is. When I realized it's really about relationship, not religion, that's my lifeline is relationship with God. I just became determined to say, well, I'm just I woke up every day at like 5 30 in the morning. I read, write, and pray. Early on, it was just kind of like, I don't really know what I'm doing. Tell me to do this and it works, I'm doing it. My life is definitely changing. That would have been like the first months, you know, it was just kind of like, I'm doing this right, but then you start to experience God, his presence, his voice, and the change that comes about in thinking, the change that comes about in behavior. I tried everything medications, every drug that was out, at least then. But there's a lot more now. Every drug that was out, I tried a new girlfriend, a new job, a new city, new friends, new I just I tried everything from the outside in. But uh when it became from the inside out, that's when I really started to get to know God and things really started to change on a different level.

SPEAKER_00 12:54

When did you realize trying harder was quietly destroying you?

SPEAKER_01 13:00

Yeah, I'll I'll say it like the effort is required. No one's gonna get anywhere doing nothing. It's not like you pray and sit on the couch and wait, you know, 10 minutes, and if God doesn't do it, you're like, see, I'm done with this, this doesn't work. We we have our part to play, but it comes down to what's the effort I'm putting in and how am I putting that effort in. When I when I realized that it's all grace, when I realized that God accepts me, and when I realize that I really I'm not gonna change my entire life overnight. It's not gonna happen. But if I'll take this process serious and I'll stay present on a daily basis, well, it's not so much about just like I need to try hard, I need to work hard, I need to grind, I need to hustle, I need to, I just need more, more, more, more, more. Hard work's great. I have uh respect for hard work and it's required to get where we want to go. But what are the actions we're taking? What are the actions that we're taking? Maybe one way to describe it about trying hard. Like we like to think the person that works the hardest always makes the most money. That's not true. If that were true, then the the roofing companies and landscaping companies in Florida that got their people out there working in 100 degrees with 100 degree humidity, they should be getting paid the most out of anybody. But it's just not true. There's there's there's effective, smarter ways to do things. Now that's obviously an analogy for business, but if we're talking about, you know, personal transformation, it really comes down to just submitting to God's way of doing things. In rest and submitting to his ways better than mine, I tried, I tried everything. It led me to death's doorstep, it wasn't gonna work. And when I submitted and began to renew my mind and establish relationship, well, then those efforts that I'm putting in, uh they have a much greater yield to them, much bigger reward on the other side.

SPEAKER_00 14:52

Describe the moment God exposed the lies shaping your identity.

SPEAKER_01 15:00

I don't know if there's one moment everything truly is rooted in identity. Think if you look at it like this, uh one of the ways I like to describe it is like everyone has a core belief. Everyone has a like a a belief in their core about who they are, who the world, you know, how they see the world, who God is or who God isn't. And whether they realize it or not, they're operating from that. Whether they've ever even gone through it and decided what they believe or explored what they believe in detail. They're functioning from a core belief system. And it really was like layers getting peeled back for me. Because I had, you know, my family being Mormon, like there's some Jesus in the Mormon religion, God bless them, but uh it's not the Jesus. And it was it wasn't so much about information, like I read this information and then okay, it all made sense to me. It was more so about relationship. I'll give you one example. I grew up uh well, I I spent quite a few years in the the hip-hop world, made a few albums, and I I like hip hop. And coming into recovery and and being transformed, it's like we can be aware of what we're putting into our mind. We like to just think we can, if we put anything we want in there, it's not gonna affect us. It's just it's just not true. What we put in our mind is gonna come out through our through our words and actions. And I was still like maybe, I don't know, a year into my my journey of getting to know God and my life being transformed, and I just felt like Holy Spirit was telling me, like, miss, stop listening to hip-hop. And it didn't really make sense at first, but I was like, all right, I I get it, what it's talking about, what's getting in my mind and everything. And I was intentional about doing that. And uh once I stopped doing that, my mind just began to shift. Immediately, like I stopped cussing. I used to cuss like a sailor, and I stopped. It was like impossible for me to do that on my own. My mind started shifting about the world and and whatnot. And so it it was a process of learning my my identity. They're like, I don't need to perform for for you or anyone or God. I don't need to perform, I'm accepted, I'm loved, and that's the place that I moved from. And when that slowly but surely got ingrained into my thinking, well, it's gonna change your approach to how you live every single day. Every single day, it's it's gonna change how I'm thinking, why I'm doing what I'm doing, how much of it I'm doing, who I'm around. So I don't know if there was one moment, there was certainly many different encounters, experiences, so to speak, I had with with God, but it was really just a process of really getting honest about what it is that I think and how I process things, and getting honest with God and realizing, yeah, that's not the best way to be thinking about this. There's a different perspective and approach that works much, much better.

SPEAKER_00 17:51

Yeah. With your family being warming and having a religion with God, what was their experience like seeing you, seeing their son go through what you went through with with your addiction? And did they try to help you at all? And you know, where are they at now knowing that you are now have a relationship with Christ?

SPEAKER_01 18:19

Yes, a good question. The family dynamics of addiction are they're there with anybody that's going through it. And, you know, the way I was living was just it absolutely hurt my family. Uh put them through some hell for sure. They never gave up. They drew some lines, there were some boundaries eventually, but they never just gave up. It got to the point where my my mom and dad were basically just like, you're not allowed to be, you know, for family dinner or holiday or something, sure, but you can't just you can't just be out stolen from them and just it was just a problem. It was always a problem. But they always said, but if you want help, well, if if if you ever call and you want us to help you get help, we'll do that. And eventually I did, and they did help and have always been there to support. And I think it was a little uh eye-opening for them, we'll use that terminology, going from how I was living to the transformation that was taking place. But all I have good relationships with I have five brothers and sisters, typical Mormon family, real big. I have two brothers and three sisters. I have good relationships with every single one of my siblings and my mom and dad. So they never really completely shut me out, but no, those relationships are good now.

SPEAKER_00 19:36

Good. And you mentioned earlier that you went to a we started to go to an AA meeting. Is that the only meeting that you went to? Or did you actually go to a rehab center? Um to help with your recovery?

SPEAKER_01 19:52

Yeah, I went to a couple of them. Uh one when I was 21. Uh I didn't last do that whole program. My gosh, maybe halfway through or whatever, I just ran walked out the front door one day and I was high that night, and uh totaled my car in a blackout two weeks later. Maybe some seeds were planted, but the transformation certainly didn't take fruit. Uh 26 into another one, just a 30-day one. And, you know, treatment, the whole treatment world is an interesting one. Treatment is definitely needed for, you know, certain people, certain times in their journey, like some separation, you know, a controlled, structured environment to get some clarity and learn to grow. But treatment doesn't fix anybody. It doesn't cure people. I mean, the success rate coming out of treatment is like less than 5%. And that's not all on the treatment centers. I think there's a decent amount that is, but it's not all on them. The the real transformation takes place when you when you get out and you're f you have some freedom to free will to do what you choose. Treatment definitely helped. Helps you get your feet under you a little bit, helped me get some clarity. But then I did start going to AA, and you know that the 12 steps are all straight from the Bible. Uh if I remember correctly, it's on the AA website. It was a pastor from New York named Reverend Shoemaker, who was the founder of the Oxford houses who wrote those 12 steps. AA didn't come up with them. Those 12 steps, those principles, are straight from the Bible. That's why they work so well. And going into AA was very much a new experience for me, but it's really what I needed. I needed to be in community. I needed to be around people that understood it. I needed to be helping. I needed a a good season of that. Yeah, I was going to to church and it was really early on, figuring out what a relationship with God even looks like. But I did I did go to church, but it was primarily AA that really, really helped me early on.

SPEAKER_00 21:45

Okay. Why do you say sobriety isn't enough and what does real freedom actually look like?

SPEAKER_01 21:55

Yeah, it's a good question. I mean, so sobriety by definition is just, you know, you're you're sober. Drugs are alcohol in the system. But again, if you take someone, say they've been in addiction for 10 years or whatever, and you just take the drugs and alcohol away, well, it's not like waving a magic wand over 'em. Just because the drugs and alcohol are gone and you're sober doesn't mean you're necessarily stepping into the process of transformation. And I've seen a lot of people try it that way, you know, uh, and go back or live some time, you know, being sober, and uh they're just not maybe the happy. Happiest people in the world. But when we understand, like this isn't just a surface level change my outward actions, it's a deep transformation that needs to take place inside. And there's a very big difference between just being sober, which is awesome, and that's the starting place. But there's a very big difference between that and then really taking accountability and responsibility, like I've said, to really take responsibility for my actions, full accountability for where my life is at the current moment, and begin to do the underlying work, which is again, drugs and alcohol aren't the addict or alcoholic's problem. It's really not, it's their solution to the real problem that's going on inside. And that's that that's what I'll say the difference between sobriety and recovery is. Sobriety is there's just no drugs or alcohol. Recovery is I'm actively engaged in my transformation.

SPEAKER_00 23:27

Now you said you're a vessel and author of recovering reality. Tell us about the book and what what is it about?

SPEAKER_01 23:37

Yeah, I appreciate you you bringing it up. It's it's my story, uh, but it's not just my story. It's I use my story to talk about um a much bigger picture, a much wider view. Uh I talk about the the problems that are going on with addiction in America. Uh use my story to talk about how addiction gets its hooks inside of you mentally, spiritually, physically, and what that looks like as you get sucked into it and how you stay into it. And then what does the transformation look like? What does it really look like to surrender? And my my initial moment of surrender was sitting in a car where there was, you know, as I was getting pulled over and there's a cop behind me, and I'm chained smoking cigarettes because I know I'm going to jail. I was smoked at the time and can't smoke in there. And I just prayed in my car. Didn't even say it out loud. I just said it in my heart and basically just let God, I can't do this anymore. I'm done. I need help. And that surrender moment there really is when things began to shift, and then, you know, and then I shift in the book into what does it really look like? What's going on in the body, you know, physiologically, what's going on mentally, and what's going on spiritually as someone steps into real freedom in their life. And so I basically just use my story to talk about a much bigger issue and what's really going on underneath the surface.

SPEAKER_00 25:00

Now, do you help? What is it that you do now? I know you're a biblical life coach. Do you help people that are struggling with addiction or in recovery?

SPEAKER_01 25:13

Yeah. So what I do is I come alongside and I I don't not everyone I work with is is struggling with addiction. Interestingly enough, the principles that people are begin to walk out in their life that pertain to addiction, those same things that work with other people's struggles and that they got going on in their life, most of them. And so, but the majority, probably the people that I work with are people who are struggling or who are early on, and just begin to walk alongside of them, coach them, keep them accountable, really help address mindsets, talk about what's really going on. The difference between therapy and coaching in my mind looks like this. Therapy is very much geared around like what happened in your past when you were a child, how did it make you feel? They typically give you a new label, some sort of new diagnosis, and oftentimes here's a new medication. I'm not against all of that. There's plenty of good therapists and counselors. Coaching is different in the sense of yes, there's a therapeutic aspect to it, but coaching is very much about let's find the solution and get active in it. Let's let's pinpoint what the mindset is here, the perspective you have, let's pinpoint what the issue is in your heart, and then let's take accountability for it and let's begin to partner that with practical action steps. And then let's stay accountable and begin to really step into this journey of freedom that you're on. A lot of people stepping into recovery. There's, you know, some people say like, well, AA is the only way. Well, church is the only way. Well, this is the only way. There's a lot of different ways. I've seen people get sober and step into their recovery in many, many different ways. So my job is to come alongside of them. What does recovery look like in your life? You know, for instance, like working with a doctor who runs his own practice, who has functioned at a high level but has a drinking problem, is going to look much different than working with someone whose parents reached out to me, who's a college student, who has been strung out lying in bed for six months on fentanyl and Xanax. The starting place is not the exact same. The same principles are applied, but what does it look like in your life and where you're currently at? And so we just begin to walk alongside people, coach them, give them the tools and the guidance and the encouragement and show them how to really step into real freedom.

SPEAKER_00 27:17

For someone that may be listening who has either addiction problem or may have friends or family members with addiction problems, what would you say to encourage them to either help them get, you know, help the help that they need or help their friend or family member get the help that they need?

SPEAKER_01 27:40

Yeah, I'll start with the family members. One thing that I'll say is it it can be obviously very draining and difficult. And I've seen about as bad as it gets in people's lives. And you know, there is times to draw boundaries and tough love, so to speak. But I also say this, it's like when someone's really, really hurting, when they're eventually ready to take some responsibility and get some help, well, they're gonna go to the people or the person that was patient and kind with them. Not okay with their actions, not condoning their actions, but they're gonna go get help from people who never cut off communication who have been encouraging and kind. And so I say to the family members and friends, it's like, do everything you can to, you know, love them, have boundaries when you you know, when that time is needed for sure. But letting them know also like if if you're really ready for help, you can reach out and I'll help you. And to the person who's struggling with addiction, you know, asking for help is often looked at as a sign of weakness. I think it's the exact opposite. I think asking for help is a sign of strength, because if you're asking for help, it shows that you know you're capable of more, you just don't know how to access it. And so drugs and alcohol, there's a long list of other addictions we can name, sex, clean hopping food. You know, it's a lot of the same underlying principles and and and issues in people's lives. It's just a different avenue they're on. And I just I just encourage you, it's very possible. I used to tell people if if if I can do it, you can do it. And now I tell them I'm like, well, if I can do it, you guys are all out of excuses. If I could do it. And so I just encourage them as much as I can. I know the struggle, I I know the pain, I I get it wholeheartedly. But uh, the sooner you can ask for help and get yourself in around people that are gonna keep you accountable and are gonna encourage you and help you, the sooner you can step into this journey because the addiction's always gonna limit you from stepping into your potential.

SPEAKER_00 29:38

You talk about identity being at the root of addiction. Can you explain what you mean by that?

SPEAKER_01 29:47

Yeah, I mean, somebody believes wholeheartedly, well, I'm just a drug addict, alcoholic, this is just the life that I have now. Well, then you're literally using your faith to stay stuck in it. You've come into full agreement. This is who I am. And the gospel doesn't tell me that, doesn't say that. Says I've, you know, I was co-crucified with Christ. I was made brand new and born again. I'm not God's eternal fixer-up or project. Yeah, he's he's helping me. There's things I'm gonna be changing for a long time, but he's not renovating the house. He destroyed that one and gave me a new one. And so when I lock my mind into it, I'll say this very quickly too. For some neuroscience, your brain doesn't care about you. It's not for you and it's not against you. They realize through studies. It's it's really not. It's not moving either way. Your brain is responding to what it's told. What you hear in there, what you are telling yourself, and what you are thinking is what your brain is going to believe, for good or for bad. And when we start locking our mind into, man, I'm a new creation. I have been born from above. I'm it's a real reality that I've experienced and billions of other people on this planet. It's a very real reality. And when I really started to understand my identity and lock my belief system into that, it's not a magic trick. You don't wave a wand and voila, your life is perfect and you think perfect now. Just like it wasn't, you know, wave it wasn't a one-stop thing to get you fully stuck in addiction either. There was a process that pulled you into that. When I really meditate on and lock my mind into who God says I am, well, that's naturally going to flow out from my life. So what somebody believes about themselves and who they believe God is is going to be a cornerstone in their recovery. Whether it's good thinking or bad.

SPEAKER_00 31:41

You've coaxed CEOs, athletes, and everyday people. What's the one thing they all have in common when they're stuck?

SPEAKER_01 31:51

They're people. I guess I'll start there. It's like someone has a ton of money or influence or recognition underneath it all in the heart. They're they're just people. Oftentimes it becomes harder for people who have all of that because they can build a bigger fence or push keep people at bay because I'm doing well, I got money, and there's obviously nothing wrong in my life, but they're they're just people. And the underlying issues are typically the same. Typically the same. Shame, guilt, regret. Things just start to settle down on us like a wet blanket. When we when we're talking about transformation, it's not so much an intellectual conversation and language. It's a language with the heart. If I'm truly gonna help somebody, I need access to their heart. They need to trust me. They need to know I have your best intentions in mind and I'm helping you. And so I approach it the same way, whether it's somebody I'm talking to who is doing amazing and has, you know, maybe more money than they know what to do with, or somebody whose parents reached out to me and I'm talking to them while they're laying in a hospital bed. And the night before their friend died driving the car in a DUI, and they're in the hospital today. And that's when I started talking to one of my clients on the phone while he's laying in bed the next day. You can't start at the same place, but it's still language of the heart. You gotta get you gotta get access to the heart and and help them really start to process that stuff and let truth be established.

SPEAKER_00 33:16

What would you say to someone who has tried every program and still keeps going back?

SPEAKER_01 33:24

First and foremost, I'd say don't don't give up. Don't give up. There's a lot of people out there, myself included, who have been to the depths of hell and are now living in freedom. And so it certainly is possible, right? And if you don't have any hope, simplest definition of hope I can give is hopelessness is you look to the future and you don't see anything good in your life. Hope is you look into your future and you see good in your life. If you've tried many things and you feel like it just hasn't worked uh and you don't have any hope, well, get around people that do have hope. You know, there's gotta be a change in it in thinking and environment. If if all of your thinking led you to that place, well, the current thinking that you have isn't gonna get you out of it. Einstein has a great quote that I use all the time. He says, You're not gonna solve a problem with the same thinking that created it. And so it's uh it's a humbling and saying, okay, I've tried, I haven't been able to. Certainly it's possible, there's plenty of people doing it. Uh what is how do how does it I need to humble myself and get around people that can really help me? How does it need to humble myself and realize, oh, I'm I'm not the end all be all here? Like my the way I think isn't perfect, and I need to change some things. You know, and I I I just can't share my story without sharing, you know. I tried everything. I tried everything. When it finally worked when I when I gave my life to Jesus, not a not a religious ritual, a real relationship or of surrender to him, and and it changed everything. I started my recovery, I hated religion. I was never going to church again. But this Jesus made sense. I was like, man, he he makes sense. All this religion and church stuff, like which is funny now because I speak in churches regularly and worked in many of coached leadership teams at churches and pastors, so God's got a sense of humor. But I just wanted nothing to do with the organization and structure of it. But it really came down to getting to know him personally. For me, nothing else worked, it changed everything.

SPEAKER_00 35:29

At the time with that mindset of you not g ever going back to church and never attending church and not believing in God, what well what do you what do you think had w what do you think was that mindset that why w why do you have that mindset?

SPEAKER_01 35:47

Yeah, I mean, I always believed in God. Uh after the counters I had when I was young. I just didn't know what my belief was. I didn't know. And I just didn't have a good experience with religion. My definition of religion would be the simplest way I can say it would just be religion's a list of rules that you need to obey and a checklist you need to go through, and then God will be okay with you. And relationship is completely different. Relationship is you can't clean yourself up no matter how hard you try and every attempt you. It's impossible. It will not happen. It starts by understanding I'm a mess and laying at his feet and saying help. Help. And so it was just really a surrender. And I've used that word surrender, and this is the way I say, you know, oftentimes we look at surrender, and maybe addiction's not your issue and you're listening, maybe it's something else. I look at surrender like this. Surrender, obviously tied to military. I'm surrendering and I give up. Well, I'm not surrendering to defeat. I'm surrendering because I was defeated. But I'm surrendering, like when you get held captive, you know, you go to a PLW prisoner of war camp, right? So you're you were defeated and now you're surrendering to defeat. That's not what recovery is about in relationship with God. I'm surrendering because I was defeated, but I'm surrendering to victory. I'm surrendering myself over to victory and a new way of living, thinking, and being around new people and new environments and realizing I really have to be intentional. Everything's got to be new for me to succeed in this. Yeah, I appreciate that, man. When we've kept it real simple, it's recovering reality.reality.com, the recovering reality podcast, recovering reality freedmen from the Torment of Addiction book, Recovering Reality Instagram. My wife coaches women as well. Hers is Recovering Reality Women. So I've just kept it really simple. Recovering Reality. Okay. You can find me there.

SPEAKER_00 37:51

And I read my deck, my guest to give my audience a word of encouragement as we get rid of the end here.

SPEAKER_01 38:01

Yeah, gladly. Well, I'll just go off of encouragement. I love encouragement. I think encouragement is an underutilized tool. I'm not talking about flattery. I'm not talking about like, oh yeah, you're awesome. Love you. Have a good day. I'm talking about like real encouragement when you're speaking into someone's heart, when you know what's really going on in their life. My encouragement to you today would be to be around encouraging people and encourage people. If you look at the word itself, encouragement. What are you doing when you encourage somebody? You're stirring up the courage within them. Encouragement. We all need courage to do what we're called to do, especially in this crazy world. And I just would encourage you, be an encourager. Be intentional about being around people who are genuinely encouraging. And I guarantee your life will change. I guarantee it.

SPEAKER_00 38:49

Well, Eric Segrison, thank you so much for coming on the show today. We greatly appreciate having you.

SPEAKER_01 38:57

Oh, you're very welcome, man. I love what you're doing. You got a good heart. Thanks for having me on.

SPEAKER_00 39:01

Absolutely. Well, guys and girls, thank you so much for tuning in for listening. We'll have the information for Eric's book and his website in the show notes. Please go and check out his information and please go and check and re um leave a review for this podcast and check out previous episodes as well. And until next time, God bless. Bye bye.